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The End of the USA

Huntn

Huntn

Misty Mountains Envoy
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The title of this thread is not to insist the USA will cease to exist, but really am asking what are our odds of surviving as a democratic republic?

Sure everything seems normal when you look out your window, but I’ll propose that a shit storm Tsunsmi is forming in DC and it will sweep across the Nation. Authority in DC is basically up for grabs. We have a Congress who are half in on The Con along with a sizable portion of SCOTUS. Right there, we’re in huge trouble,

The Authority of the Federal Government is being subverted to the will of a self serving Gangsta in DC. He has learned from last time. People telling him “no” was bad so he is doing all he can to eliminate this obstacle to finish the job he started last time, installing himself as Supreme Leader. Every vital appointed post is being filled with one qualifier, loyalty to The Emperor. Secondly having a lot of wealth that needs protecting is a plus for The Head Conman’s consideration.

The outcome is that the Federal Govt will no longer be source of truth but one of deceit with the purpose of holding on to power. Lawfulness is a fantasy, instead there is a pretense of lawfulness that acts as a curtain to hide cheating and corruption. When everything starts to fall apart we’re going to get all manner of tall tales from DC.

Yeah, I know some will say this was already the case. My position is whatever it was before, it will be 100x worse and it will lack the intent of maintaining our Republic. The preferred model seems to be Dictator and Oligarchs, our media is converting to Pravda West.

Our civil liberties will suffer when it’s deemed those are a source, not so much of discontentment, but a threat to the power structure, especially free speech. It’s hard not to feel, we’re screwed. 😳
 
Huntn said:
The title of this thread is not to insist the USA will cease to exist, but really am asking what are our odds of surviving as a democratic republic?

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@Huntn: This is an excellent suggestion for a discussion, but please, please, please, consider changing the thread title to reflect what you have written in your opening sentence:

Might I suggest a thread title that reads something along the lines of: "The End of the USA as a Democratic Republic".
 
Scepticalscribe said:
@Huntn: This is an excellent suggestion for a discussion, but please, please, please, consider changing the thread title to reflect what you have written in your opening sentence:

Might I suggest a thread title that reads something along the lines of: "The End of the USA as a Democratic Republic".
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That’s an emotional response, and I guess it boils down to that you picture “ending” to mean, but I’ve bowed to your wish. Ending does not have to mean destroyed but that is certainly a possibility, and that destruction can be physical or it can be the “United States” no longer existing as uniited states, such that the USA has ceased to exist.
 
Huntn said:
That’s an emotional response, and I guess it boils down to that you picture “ending” to mean, but I’ve bowed to your wish. Ending does not have to mean destroyed but that is certainly a possibility, and that destruction can be physical or it can be the “United States” no longer existing as uniited states, such that the USA has ceased to exist.
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I'm not sure that I would call it an "emotional" response, more a preference for precision in language, and a deep dislike of what I think thread titles that can be mistaken for, or confused with, a kind of "click-bait".

In any case, I do want to thank you for amending the thread title so that it reflects more accurately what the thread wishes to discuss, which is an incredibly important and vitally necessary discussion to have, given what is happening these days in the US.

Personally, my view is that what is currently taking place is a coup d'état - and Mr Trump already has form with this, as the events of 6th January 2021 made all too lamentably clear - a coup d'état where large sections of the business and economic elite, the tech elite, the media (and, in time, I would argue, the judiciary and the Republican Party in the Houses of Congress) are all too conniving and all too complicit (or fearful) in what is currently taking place.

Meanwhile, I would argue that much of the outrageous foreign policy stuff is a mixture of gaslighting, normalising new horrors, introducing a new take on transactional imperialism and performative autocracy, while using chaos and fear as a distraction, a masking fog, to dismantle constitutional and institutional protections, norms and guardrails, in the setting of US domestic politics, so that what was once a flawed democracy is fast becoming an administration of affluent white men who are little more than a bunch of criminal and ethics-free oligarchs.
 
The president wants to override the will of Congress. He is shuttering agencies, blatantly defying the law. By failing to act, Congress is abdicating their constitutional responsibility.
 
SouprMatt said:
The president wants to override the will of Congress. He is shuttering agencies, blatantly defying the law. By failing to act, Congress is abdicating their constitutional responsibility.
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Not to worry.

When it all goes completely tits up, the republicans in charge of both sides of congress, will identify the real reason it all went wrong.

Dems should have acted sooner.
 
Scepticalscribe said:
I'm not sure that I would call it an "emotional" response, more a preference for precision in language, and a deep dislike of what I think thread titles that can be mistaken for, or confused with, a kind of "click-bait".

In any case, I do want to thank you for amending the thread title so that it reflects more accurately what the thread wishes to discuss, which is an incredibly important and vitally necessary discussion to have, given what is happening these days in the US.

Personally, my view is that what is currently taking place is a coup d'état - and Mr Trump already has form with this, as the events of 6th January 2021 made all too lamentably clear - a coup d'état where large sections of the business and economic elite, the tech elite, the media (and, in time, I would argue, the judiciary and the Republican Party in the Houses of Congress) are all too conniving and all too complicit (or fearful) in what is currently taking place.

Meanwhile, I would argue that much of the outrageous foreign policy stuff is a mixture of gaslighting, normalising new horrors, introducing a new take on transactional imperialism and performative autocracy, while using chaos and fear as a distraction, a masking fog, to dismantle constitutional and institutional protections, norms and guardrails, in the setting of US domestic politics, so that what was once a flawed democracy is fast becoming an administration of affluent white men who are little more than a bunch of criminal and ethics-free oligarchs.
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In other words a coup is underway and I’m wondering why I amended the title of this thread… The End of the USA as we all thought we knew it… The End of the USA to be replaced by Lil’Donny Land. The End of the USA by itself sounds like a reasonable title at this point. 🤔
 
Jay Mysteri0 said:
Not to worry.

When it all goes completely tits up, the republicans in charge of both sides of congress, will identify the real reason it all went wrong.

Dems should have acted sooner.
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We were fucked by our democracy, the lack of will, and a broke bad population who elected enough shits to Congress because they were unhappy with the way it was going. Now maybe they did not mean burn it down, but this is now distinctly a possibility. Of note we have a huge country full of diversity, but it was arguably (hopefully a minority) of racists and a general lack of back bone to put them in their place that got us where we are today. If you need a modern label, it’s MAGOTs (sometimes known as MAGA).

Look at the huge middle class that came to be at the end of WWII, it’s been shrinking ever since until today we are at a crisis level. But the dummies want to blame immigrants and minorities instead of the real culprits. Poor little white folks who feel like they’re not privileged enough, and that the good times were stolen from them. In many cases this could be described as accurate, but it’s not diversity that fucked them, it’s Capitalism and for-profit Mega-Corporations who want to monetize everything. In many cases, racism keeps them in the fold., They want to be rich, just like the country club folks.

If you were lucky enough to be white and middle class, your odds were pretty good to find a good paying job. But how many millions of jobs were exported over the last 50 years? We’re just their pawns as the cannibalistic system devours itself. Destroying DEI is just a way to keep the MAGOTs wriggling in the ‘Right’ direction. 🤬
 
Thomas Veil said:

Is this what we're calling the Constitution now?
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More instructive is the fact that this quote suggests that they are now openly attempting to put forward the argument that this is what the election was actually all about and that this is what they fought the election on.

Worse, with the emphatic use of the verb "prevailed", they are now claiming that the "views" and "judgments" that "prevailed in the election" are those that they currently hold, and - according to this twisted logic - are policy positions that they now have a mandate to not just hold but to implement.
 
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It's a ridiculous argument to make because instead of a government which is designed to serve all the people, they're looking at it as a purely partisan thing.

Which is fine if you think each succeeding election should have us constantly lurching right, then left, then right, then left, like two belligerent pilots fighting over the controls of a helicopter that is swaying wildly from side to side in the air.
 
USAID was one of the finest organizations in the world. An example of Americans working for the good of all.

U.S. Agency for International Development

www.usaid.gov www.usaid.gov

Now it’s gone, and their workers are being treated like pariahs for helping those in need.

We are a nation built on ideals and principles. They have been completely abandoned by our leaders. This is truly a sad time to be alive.
 
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Straight out of 1984…

…two individuals, both former officials who were being considered for positions within the intelligence community, were asked to give “yes” or “no” responses to the questions: Was Jan. 6 “an inside job?” And was the 2020 presidential election “stolen?”
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These individuals, who did not give the desired straight “yes” answer, were not selected.
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…Separately, at least two individuals in FBI field offices outside Washington, who were being interviewed for senior positions, were asked similar questions…Who were the “real patriots” on January 6? Who won the 2020 election? Who is your “real boss?”
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😳😳😳

It’s possible that yet another lawsuit could stop Trump from hiring people for the FBI and the intelligence community under these standards, but I wouldn’t bet on it.

Even if a court puts a stop to it, the question remains what happens when Trump decides he doesn’t want to listen to the courts anymore?

I never thought we’d get to the point where a military coup by career (I.e., Constitution-allegiant) officers would seem like a good thing, but here we are.

U.S. intelligence, law enforcement candidates face Trump loyalty test
 
Thomas Veil said:
Straight out of 1984…





😳😳😳

It’s possible that yet another lawsuit could stop Trump from hiring people for the FBI and the intelligence community under these standards, but I wouldn’t bet on it.

Even if a court puts a stop to it, the question remains what happens when Trump decides he doesn’t want to listen to the courts anymore?

I never thought we’d get to the point where a military coup by career (I.e., Constitution-allegiant) officers would seem like a good thing, but here we are.

U.S. intelligence, law enforcement candidates face Trump loyalty test
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Honestly, I doubt they'll be able to hire competent people with such bullshit. Remember trump #1, everybody was deputy this/that in the cabinet, everybody leaked continuously, and similarly to how nobody will want to be an air traffic controller (why would anybody want to deal with the political pressure, blame game, and horrid staffing) they'll have a very difficult time retaining and hiring people who are able to do the actual job these agencies do.

My fear is that the spectacular crumble of these institutions will reward republicans longitudinally once again, as we've seen with COVID.
 
P___X said:
Honestly, I doubt they'll be able to hire competent people with such bullshit. Remember trump #1, everybody was deputy this/that in the cabinet, everybody leaked continuously, and similarly to how nobody will want to be an air traffic controller (why would anybody want to deal with the political pressure, blame game, and horrid staffing) they'll have a very difficult time retaining and hiring people who are able to do the actual job these agencies do.

My fear is that the spectacular crumble of these institutions will reward republicans longitudinally once again, as we've seen with COVID.
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Unless there is sufficient pushback pretty soon, this will happen.

There is a reason that dictatorships have collapsed economies. Incompetent sycophants are the ones in charge.
 
SouprMatt said:
Unless there is sufficient pushback pretty soon, this will happen.

There is a reason that dictatorships have collapsed economies. Incompetent sycophants are the ones in charge.
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Yup, which takes us to
Huntn said:
The Head Liar’s working hard to mak himself a dictator, ofthird world shit hole.
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How hilariously ironic that the US used to lecture countries descending into authoritarianism, then outdoing them on the same topic.
 
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